Arizona secession talk heats up - Your West Valley News: Suncity

Arizona secession talk heats up

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Posted: Saturday, November 24, 2012 4:15 am

WASHINGTON — Arizona has been in the union more than a century, but some residents appear to want out.

A petition to let the state secede went up on the White House website recently and it already has received more than half of the 25,000 signatures needed to trigger an official response.

The petition was one of about 45 such petitions from states, some repeats, posted on the White House site in recent weeks. It has until Dec. 10 to reach its goal, although Sun City West resident Fred Voosen said he is not paying much attention to Arizona’s petition or any others.

“It’s not legal,” he said. “Texas is the only state I’m aware of that can do it. So I don’t think we’re going to see people in those other states taking up arms any time soon. I doubt that seriously.”

Voosen said he believes the petitions stem from frustration and the people signing them probably know nothing will happen.

“The secession thing is never going to happen, so I guess it’s basically symbolic,” he said. “A lot of people didn’t vote for the party in power now, and they’re disgruntled.”

Patricia Shanholtzer, who also lives in Sun City West, thought little of the petition’s merit. She went as far as to say she finds it offensive.

“My son is active duty in the armed services and deployed,” she said. “He missed his daughter’s birth, and he’ll miss her first steps, her first birthday, Thanksgiving, Christmas. He is overseas fighting in part to protect our freedom of speech, and I find it terribly ironic that those freedoms also protect those on the lunatic fringe.”

She said she believes secession petitions only serve to further divide an already divided nation.

“It’s a waste of time,” she said. “I mean, secession? Didn’t we fight a war over that already? We have a hard enough time accomplishing anything as it is. This petition, it won’t help.”

Shanholtzer also questioned how Arizona would function as its own nation.

“I wonder if anyone has thought that through,” she said. “What do we produce here? What is our industry? How are we going to raise and pay for a standing army? It’s silly.”

White House spokesman Brandon Lepow confirmed that the administration will respond if the petition gets the required number of signatures, but said he could not comment on the specific petition until then.

The White House would not release the identity of the man who started the petition, identified only as Nicholas M. of Gilbert. The White House website gives no more than a last initial and hometown for people who signed the petition, many of whom were from outside Arizona.

But a laughing Gregg Cawley said there should be no fear of another civil war anytime soon as a result of the secession petitions.

“One of the big differences between now and the mid-1800s … is the tremendous amount of federal funds states receive,” said Cawley, a political science professor at the University of Wyoming who has written about the relationship between Western states and the federal government.

“Do they really want to give up all that money? I think it makes the whole thing more symbolic than practical,” he said.

Cawley said people who make comments such as those in the petitions are more likely trying to “raise public visibility about their complaints” than actually succeed at secession.

That effort to raise visibility — about 45 of the more than 100 petitions on the White House site call for secession by various states — drew a quick response from other unhappy citizens on the other end of the political spectrum.

One petition asks the Obama administration “to deport everyone that signed a petition to withdraw their state from the United States of America.”

Cawley said the warring petitions should not be seen as an omen of more warring to come.

“A state cannot simply say they don’t want to be a part of the union anymore,” Cawley said.

“I wouldn’t say that these people starting these petitions are grumpy enough to actually pick up guns and start a war,” he said. “Just at a practical level, it is not going to happen.”

  • Discuss

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  • pradeeprath22 posted at 1:23 pm on Tue, Jan 19, 2016.

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    Pima was thus trying to secede from Arizona because Arizona was distancing itself from the U.S. Did you know Arizona seceded from the Union in 1861?

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  • Devildoc68 posted at 5:13 am on Sun, Nov 25, 2012.

    Devildoc68 Posts: 1

    I can see Arizona separating from the Union....then declaring war on the U.S....immediately signing a peace accord and then receiving foreign aid. Jan and Joe could be the first couple in their capital house, and John McCain their secretary of war.

  • Darr247 posted at 9:41 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    Darr247 Posts: 3

    I think Mexico should vote to add their 30 states to the USA... that would make 8 rows of 10 stars each (and, say, a green stripe as a nod to MX's current flag) in the canton of the US flag.

    Do away with both their Federal District and Washington D.C. as capitals (DC would make a good museum town), consolidating their functions and making a new Capital closer to the middle of the country... like in Montana or Wyoming, about halfway between the north slopes of Alaska and the border with Belize/Guatemala... then build a new Capitol big enough for 160 Senators (with room to expand to 200 in case Canada et al decide to join) and 1,100 Representatives, which would bring the ratio down from the current 1 representative for every 900,000 to about 1 for every 450,000 people. That would still be less than 7% of the maximum number specicified in the Constitution (1 for every 30,000).

    The 53 years since Hawaii joined is the longest period ever without the USA adding a new state.

    There... THAT should make a few TP'ers heads explode.

  • Cheeses Christ posted at 8:37 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    Cheeses Christ Posts: 2

    "notcrazyrightwing" = oxymoron... just sayin' ;-) ... you know, like "conservative think-tank", "compassionate conservatism", or "country music". That being said, you are of course, right. It would be unfair to characterize your state as 100% Republitarded... I should know, as a democrat here in Texas, it is a constant source of shame that the vast majority of the US views our state as "red"... I.e. uneducated redneck trailer park denizens married to our sisters & "rearing" broods of cross-eyed children destined to bolster Faux News viewership... afterall, some of us are Democrats! Perhaps, to accomodate the "good" citizens of Arizona, we can split Arizona in two (like Korea!). The good citizens of Arizona would retain the northern half where they could continue to enjoy statehood in the good ole' U.S. of A, & the RepubliKLAN could be contained in the southern half, the small newly-formed third world country of South Arizona, where greed, hate, & incest will dwindle their numbers rather quickly, rendering them ripe for annexation!

  • Darr247 posted at 8:04 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    Darr247 Posts: 3

    @notcrazy - I suggest they go to and sign the petition to strip citizenship from and exile all those who signed the secession petitions.

  • notcrazyrightwing posted at 7:39 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    notcrazyrightwing Posts: 1

    What about the people in az wo arent for this? Should we just fence them in with the cartel as well? Everybody in az are not crazy far right or left for that matter. Scottsdale rules our state.

  • Darr247 posted at 7:01 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    Darr247 Posts: 3

    Let them... I think any state should be allowed to secede; the guy that thinks TX is the only state allowed to is just plain wrong... all they have to do is follow their state's rules for putting initiatives on the ballot (e.g. since AZ's constitution declares the US constitution to be the law of the land, first they'd need to collect 259,000 signatures of AZ voters on a petition to vote on altering their constitution, and once that process has been completed - since a petition can address only a single issue - they could start collecting them for a referendum to secede)... then have 50% + 1 person vote in favor of secession, pay off their share of the national debt as it says in the 14th amendment, relinquish the weapons and federally owned vehicles from their National Guard armories, and renounce their citizenships (easily done at the US Embassy in Mexico City or Ottawa Ontario)... we'll commence tearing up the federal Interstate hughways where they cross the ex-state's borders and building 30-foot electrified fences around them immediately thereafter.

    Don't call us when the cartels decide they'd like to use the Salt river project's water to process their coke, or California decides they want to slant drill under Lake Havasu to tap it from below for their own use.

    At least we'll never again have to worry about any of those wingnuts running for president again. And just think of the boon to the USA's budget not having to send any more SS or medicare funds that way anymore.

    90% of them wouldn't be able to pass the naturalization test to regain citizenship even with 7 years to study, if they decide to rejoin the USA... so we don't need to worry about them voting, getting CCP's, or even owning guns, in the USA again, either. And of course, minimum wage laws shouldn't apply to non-citizens... I could use somebody to mow my lawn for $1/hour. So, yeah - great idea.

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    SH130 Posts: 1

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  • Cheeses Christ posted at 6:49 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    Cheeses Christ Posts: 2

    Oh no, whatever will we, the United States of America, do without Arizona? Where will we get the ______ that we depend on Arizona for? For starters, America & Mexico will have to join forces to erect a border fence around the newly formed country of Arizona... you know, to keep Sherriff Joe from venturing where he's not wanted! Then of course, we'll have to negotiate trade relations in order to provide "Arizonia" with the things they'll need, which is pretty much everything except sunlight & sand! But hey, at least John McCain will finally get to be the President of something! One can only imagine the new version of the "3:00am Call" commercial the McCain campaign put out against Hillary a few years back... Announcer : "It's 3:00am, the phone rings, & President McCain, startled from his Faux News induced slumber & toting a freshly loaded diaper, scrambles to his feet, grabs his walker, & embarks on his epic journey to... the other side of the bed where the phone is located!

  • 57haddreams posted at 5:25 am on Sat, Nov 24, 2012.

    57haddreams Posts: 1

    The US should sell Arizona to Mexico...that ought to shut the petitioners up!


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